Fedora Core 6 review

[mdlbear]

What I would call an entertainingly scathing review:

Fedora Core 6 review - Software in Review

Conclusions and developer recommendations

I'm through hoping that the next version of Fedora Core will fix all of the problems with the previous release. Fedora's identity has gradually eroded over six releases, finally ending up as a second class clone of Ubuntu. On the other hand, Red Hat Linux was never really all that easy to install, configure, and use, so I guess this is just the natural evolution of a product that was destined to be eclipsed by more complete distributions like Mandriva and more easily configured distributions like SUSE.

I appreciate the fact that distributions like Fedora Core are still focused on free-as-in-rights software, but today's Web content requires more proprietary browser plugins than yesterday's did, and today's hardware is increasingly designed to be dependent on proprietary binary blobs in the form of firmware and driver packages. Programmers are not falling over themselves to write free replacements for these things (or they are unable to because of a lack of documentation from hardware manufacturers), and the projects that do exist are non-operational and/or several generations behind current technology. Users do not want to hear reasons and excuses for why the operating environment doesn't work with their favorite Web sites or computer hardware -- all they know is that it doesn't work, and making it work is not a simple or obvious process. It is possible to keep the distribution free-as-in-rights while making it easy to add proprietary extras, but the Fedora Project is not willing or able to do it after six releases.

The Fedora Project has failed six consecutive times to produce a viable desktop operating system. I say pack up, move on, and let Fedora Core die, but remember it fondly as the last of the holdouts from an era when desktop GNU/Linux meant missing out on most Web media while struggling to get network drivers installed and configured. It's nice that my video cards worked with the 3D desktop effects with little effort, but wobbly windows and the cube desktop switcher don't make up for a lack of basic network functionality and ease of configuration.

So, if I may editorialize for a couple of paragraphs:

Red Hat is a server OS, and Fedora Core is basically its beta version even if they don't call it that officially. SUSE is owned by Novell, which just sold its soul to Microsoft for a handful of empty promises.

Desktop Linux is alive and well, however, and the best distro for the average PC user is going to be Ubuntu. For a server or for any non-Intel architecture, go for Debian. There's a reason why Debian and Ubuntu are doing so well: it's because they are under the control of their own users, not some corporation's shareholders.

Comments

[mithriltabby]

Hmmm... perhaps I should try Kubuntu next time I’m upgrading a machine. Is Ubuntu missing anything important that Fedora Core has (other than KDE, which you can get with Kubuntu)? How easy is it to find compatible third party RPMs for Ubuntu?

[mdlbear]

Ubuntu uses .deb's rather than .rpm's; because it's Debian-based it has access to the entire range of Debian packages (through a repository which I think is called "universe" -- I'm much more familiar with straight Debian than I am with Ubuntu).

Currently the "testing" version of Debian has something over 18000 packages, although a direct comparison isn't possible because Debian breaks programs into smaller packages sometimes.

There are several third-party repositories as well, and many programs that aren't supported directly are available as .deb's. There's also a program called "alien" that converts rpm's to deb's, though that's not a guarantee that the result will be installable.

At the moment, the only thing I know of "missing" from Ubuntu is SELinux (being added in Debian testing, but will be disabled by default). To say that KDE is "missing" from Ubuntu is somewhat misleading -- it's not installed by default from the CD, but it's in the repository. There are a lot of things that just plain aren't there anymore in the RedHat world that are still in Debian because people like me are using them. (Examples that come to mind are ctwm, xtoolwait, and Apache 1.3.)

Basically, the only difference between Ubuntu, Kubuntu, and Xubuntu is which desktop is on the distribution CD; they all pull packages from the same underlying repository. This is why they can install from a single CD instead of requiring the 5-6 DVDs required to hold all the packages that make up the full distribution.

By the way, there's a script called "easyubuntu" (if I remember correctly) that goes out to third-party repositories around the world and pulls in all of the proprietary codecs and browser plugins that you're likely to need.

[trogula.livejournal.com]

Fedora was NEVER intended to be a desktop OS - it was always a beta/bleeding edge OS. I would never use Fedora on a desktop system.


It's a very bad idea from an operations perspective to use a different distro for a server vs. a workstation - you then, in effect, create two different platforms, nearly doubling the administrative workload.

If you use Red Hat on the server, you use it on the desktop. What I do is use CentOS 4 for both server and desktop - CentOS is a 100% binary compatable distro with RHEL. All it's missing is Red Hat's trademarked images.

Debian (and apt-based systems) are a very different beast from Red Hat (and other rpm-based systems). Use one or the other, but don't ever mix both for any large installation.

Personally, all debian based systems completely lost their edge over rpm-based systems with the introduction of yum for package maintenance and updating. Given that all my clients require either RHEL or a RHEL-like system (where we use CentOS), I always use CentOS.

[mdlbear]

What you're saying is "never use Fedora", which I agree with. I personally use Debian on both desktops and servers.

I've never used Yum, but I believe Debian and apt still have the edge in the ability to correctly handle dependencies during an upgrade. Debian also has the lead in number of packages available. I abandoned RH after they stopped supporting a significant number of packages that I was still using. The RH philosophy is to only provide a limited choice of applications -- basically what they think people should be using. The Debian philosophy is to include anything that has a reasonable number of users and somebody who's willing to maintain it.

I also like the fact that Debian is supported on a wide range of architectures -- since I do embedded development, this is important. Even if I didn't, it would mean I could run the same OS on my router and NAS box that I do on my desktop.

[trogula.livejournal.com]

Yep - use the right tool for the right project. Both Debian and Red Hat are good - they are just targeted for different things. I say pick one and stick to it.

And Fedora was never good for ANYTHING. ;-)

[technoshaman.livejournal.com]

Ow, indeedy. And you're right, Maximize Shareholder Value does not a Linux distribution make.

I like the *concept* of Ubuntu as a server OS. I've not been able to execute on that yet, though; wonky hardware is part of the problem... you'd think it wouldn't be, but it is.

[mdlbear]

Ubuntu server only shows up in Edgy, IIRC, so it's early days. That's one reason why I use Debian and not Ubuntu.

[technoshaman.livejournal.com]

I think Edgy was the first to have dedicated "server" images, but if you use the "alternative" disk you can do a server on Dapper too.

The problem I have with Deb is that so much of the newer stuff you either have to get from backports (problematic) or run Etch... the long release cycle just kills Deb from a "we'd like the *latest* stable stuff, thanks" point of view... I was looking at running the new Milter stuff in Postfix 2.3, but the Sarge milter packages require sendmail explicitly, ruling out Postfix and forcing me to do it from source if atall. Not sure it's worth it, really.

[mdlbear]

Depends on what you need; I tend to run stable on routers, stable or testing as needed on servers inside the firewall, and Etch on workstations. If the Etch release is delayed past mid-December I'll probably switch my file/mail server to it anyway just to get better spam filtering. They're working on a framework for releasing updates to volatile stuff like SpamAssassin and Firefox more frequently.

[technoshaman.livejournal.com]

They are, are they? Innnnnnteresting. Linky?

[mdlbear]

Googling for "debian volatile" gets you here.

[technoshaman.livejournal.com]

Interesting... sort of. They're not allowing higher version numbers than what is in test... so, what, it's got to make it to test before they backport it to volatile? And then there's Firefox2... which I notice isn't in there yet (nor is Postfix 2.3, although I do see spamassassin...)

I'm thinking a bifurcation is needed... give me a good solid desktop platform (KDE, GNOME, Xfce, whathaveyou), then keep the things that run on top of them up to date: Firefox, Gaim, Thunderbird, Sylpheed, etc. Ditto on the server side: Solid base (dev toolchain - gcc, make, etc.) and then postfix, spamassassin, apache, etc. keep up to date. Although there might be some contention on apache... but you could do apache1 or apache2...

*sigh* It's *almost* enough to make one switch to Gentoo...

[mdlbear]

Some things might still be in experimental; I'm really not sure how it all works.

Gentoo is definitely the way to go if you want bleeding edge; I find that testing is usually good enough, though I've been known to install Firefox and Java from tarballs. And I built Audacity 1.3 from cvs a month or so back, but didn't think it was stable enough to trust with my tracks.

Debian's alternatives system is very good at allowing multiple versions and applications to coexist where it makes sense.

Hyper Penguin

[harmonyheifer.livejournal.com]

I have no earthly idea what this post is about, and trust me, I'm okay with that. But the hyper penguin is shiny!

Re: Hyper Penguin

[technoshaman.livejournal.com]

hee hee hee. If you don't mind over the top slapstick, google "Poke the Penguin". There you'll discover the origin of the hyper penguin. Just keep poking. :)

Re: Hyper Penguin

[mdlbear]

I believe I first saw it in gridlore.